Did some photo enhancement to an HD screen cap to bring out the detail of Vader's facemask.
I think I even have access to that particular mesh in the trianglular chin vent.
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| Author: | CSMacLaren [ Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Vader, EP4 Death Star Battle (inside TIE) |
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Did some photo enhancement to an HD screen cap to bring out the detail of Vader's facemask. I think I even have access to that particular mesh in the trianglular chin vent. |
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| Author: | JB-Props [ Tue Feb 05, 2008 11:03 pm ] |
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Can't quite tell what it is, but if you have a source any chance of making it available? 
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| Author: | CSMacLaren [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 2:39 am ] |
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Yeah it's generic sheet metal with holes that you can get at OSH (Orchard Home Supply). You'd have to paint it or blue it black. Just make sure the hole size and hole density matches. |
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| Author: | Too Much Garlic [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:10 pm ] |
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Interesting. The mesh in the mouth also seems much skinnier than what we are used to seeing... odd. |
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| Author: | CSMacLaren [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 3:54 pm ] |
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Well, at least the diamonds line up, NHM. |
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| Author: | JB-Props [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 4:45 pm ] |
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Would you call the hoes diamonds or circles? |
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| Author: | JB-Props [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 5:02 pm ] |
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Would you say that the mesh is flat rather then expanded? To me it looks like the pattern is punched into the metal. JB |
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| Author: | CSMacLaren [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:43 pm ] |
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JB-Props wrote: Would you call the hoes diamonds or circles?
The mouth is a mesh, and the wires of the mesh form "diamond" shapes that align in the holes. I'll try to take a photo of the grill mesh I have. There is debate, of course, as to whether this was even used. The only occurrence of this "holey metal" that I've seen is this TIE fighter scene specifically. It has been argued that regular standard diamond-grid mesh was used in the chin vent, and that light entering the eyes or mouth would illuminate the intersections and corners of the diamonds thereby creating this polka-dot effect. However, if you look carefully at pictures where this does happen, the dots on diamond meshes look like curved rectangles, not circles. This is just a screen cap of the TIE fighter scene, and the dots look unmistakably round. Also, notice that the camera is looking upwards at Vader, and notice the upwards lighting onto the neck and illuminating the eyebrows. That tells me there is much more going on than mere illumination onto the intersecting corners of diamond mesh, because the upwards lighting on the chin would have illuminated the chin triangle material and would have revealed the diamond mesh pattern if one had ever been used. No, I do think a "holey metal" and not a diamond-grid mesh was used in this particular scene -- upward illumination would have caused you to see the color of Prowse's face. I think this "holey metal" was used to obscure Prowse's face. JB, sorry it took so long for me to respond to this. I somehow overlooked your initial question. |
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| Author: | Too Much Garlic [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:48 pm ] |
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Is it consistent throughout the scenes, when he moves his head or is it coincidental to that one or a few shots? The ESB poster helmet has the same look in one of the pictures, but in the next you can clearly see it is the regular diamond mesh or stamped grill we know of. Consistency is the key. |
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| Author: | CSMacLaren [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 9:30 pm ] |
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Well, it's only a theory. We've discussed this before, but this was what I had originally shared. 
The one on the right looks less likely to be "holey metal" but it's still possible. Due to lighting, we see less holes and so it's hard to tell if the hole density is similar or not. The camera also does widen the image somewhat. |
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| Author: | Too Much Garlic [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 9:35 pm ] |
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In those close-ups, especially the one on the left, I can make out the stamped mesh look. If light comes from the side it will only light up one side of the mesh square - the one the has the surface in the direction where the light comes from. If they had lit it from two sides, both sides of the grid surface would have reflected light and would have created a v shape. However... interesting topic! 
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| Author: | JB-Props [ Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:19 am ] |
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Mac no worries at all. I appreciate that you even took the time to reply. 
I've gone back and forth on this so many times that I'm a bit dizzy. I've tried all types of combinations of mesh and as of yet I haven't found anything on my own that replicates that distinctive look. I have tried several types of mesh including different types of speaker grills both punched and stamped. Perhaps I'll round up several of them and post a picture for everyone to debate. JB |
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| Author: | JB-Props [ Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:21 am ] |
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NoHumorMan wrote: In those close-ups, especially the one on the left, I can make out the stamped mesh look. If light comes from the side it will only light up one side of the mesh square - the one the has the surface in the direction where the light comes from. If they had lit it from two sides, both sides of the grid surface would have reflected light and would have created a v shape.
However... interesting topic! It's definitely one of the last mysteries surrounding the ANH helmet isn't it. Let's hope that we can get to the bottom of this one to.
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| Author: | CSMacLaren [ Tue May 06, 2008 9:55 pm ] |
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Well, I watched ANH and took some time to observe the chin vent. It turns out it's not perforated sheet metal. The way I could tell was that in the course of approx. 2 seconds, the lighting position was shifting, and the way the mesh was responding to the light varied, giving you a kind of "3D" sense of the nature of the material. Ah well, so ends the mystery. The screen capture sure looked convincing, but yet it had to be interpreted in context of the movement of the shot. |
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| Author: | JB-Props [ Wed May 07, 2008 6:11 pm ] |
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CSMacLaren wrote: Well, I watched ANH and took some time to observe the chin vent. It turns out it's not perforated sheet metal. The way I could tell was that in the course of approx. 2 seconds, the lighting position was shifting, and the way the mesh was responding to the light varied, giving you a kind of "3D" sense of the nature of the material.
Ah well, so ends the mystery. The screen capture sure looked convincing, but yet it had to be interpreted in context of the movement of the shot. So then you are saying that it's perforated mesh? If so it must be a heavy gage metal.
JB |
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