The Prop Den

still ugly
Page 14 of 15

Author:  jedijeffrey [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Your new picture shows you sculpting on top of another helmet again! Why can't you make your own stuff? Everyone should read your BS you wrote in 2012 ( on the RPF) about people using others work, that's exactly what you did and it looks like your doing it again. You don't have permission to use anything of mine even if you "reworked" why can't you make your own?

Author:  CSMacLaren [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

And you care nothing about the fact that there's 1/2" to 1" of clay and none of the original surface is even used? Honestly, do you know what an armature is?

Move along. You're trolling. Even Art Andrews on RPF is telling you to move along.

Author:  jedijeffrey [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Whether you believe me or not doesn't matter YOU ADMITTED IT WASN'T YOURS!!
here's what you wrote on March 12th, 2012
"Years back, people might have thought differently as the definition and semantics of recasting was difficult to pinpoint. It was once discussed that someone's "work" should not be recast and would legalistically apply that to say a direct (unmodified) recast of a Don Post Deluxe. I prefer to think that a person's "work" should be defined as what work was done *to* a prop as opposed to simply pulling a recast from a mold. Personally, I would not use, say, SPFX's work as a base, even though he in turn had pirated and modified other helmets to produce his products. If I owned one and wanted to beef up the face, if it didn't require a lot of rework, I would still consider it an SPFX, and were I ever to unload it, I'd describe it as a one-off modified SPFX and inform the new owner to not allow it to be recast.
After all, I'm a sculptor. I feel strongly against illicit recasting. I want to protect my own work and I'm sensitive to protecting other sculptors, having seen their pain whenever their work is pirated and cheap casts are sold on fleaBay."
how do you defend that?
In essence your doing exactly what you say others shouldn't, If there was ever a question of your "integrity" we now know the answer. this part of your thread kills me
"I want to protect my own work and I'm sensitive to protecting other sculptors, having seen their pain whenever their work is pirated and cheap casts are sold on fleaBay."
Your full of it, your no different than any other recaster. The picture of "your" new helmet clearly shows you sculpting on top of a different dome, more of your "rework" ?
A REAL artist would not be "reworking" any one elses work. Your no artist.
I don't care what Art says. your no artist your a scumbag, who steals from others.

Author:  jedijeffrey [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Do i now get banned for calling you out?

Author:  CSMacLaren [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Until you prove your claims instead of countering questions with more questions and changes of topic, you are basically trolling.

You've been given every opportunity on both boards to prove original authorship and have not only failed to do so, but now you resort to personal attacks and character assassination. For shame. Very poor form.

Author:  jedijeffrey [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

There's no trolling, only your BS on integrity and being an "artist"
You have answered nothing, one question, is it ok to rework someone else's work and call it your own, that's all you have to answer.

Author:  CSMacLaren [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Nice try at misdirection.

Here is your ORIGINAL private message to me that preceded all this.

jedijeffrey wrote:
I did not give you permisson to rework the original "ugly" helmet and then sell copies of it. I gave no one persmission to do anything with it. I was making helmets at least a year before your "darth ugly". And yes I can prove it, you may not sell any of these helmets. I don't care if you reworked the helmet it wasn't yours to mess with.

Your words are "And yes I can prove it". So prove you are the original author of darth ugly.

Author:  jedijeffrey [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 4:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Answer the question

Author:  CSMacLaren [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 4:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Proof is the burden of the accuser. You made the accusation; you are the accuser here.

So prove, otherwise you're just a jealous, bitter troll, attempting baiting and entrapment tactics.

PROVE. But I do find this most amusing that you claim you're Ugly's dad. :toothy

Author:  CSMacLaren [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 5:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

You know what, bub, I'm onto you. I realize why you're trying so hard to misdirect everything I've said and try to villify me. You want to recast Darth Ugly, plain and simple. And by trying to win the accusation, you'll give yourself recasting "rights".

Here's thanks to a little research of your recasting past:

SOURCE: ... mow-30269/

Man of War Studios: Anyone here familiar with a guy on eBay who goes by the name "Vader-revealed" ? He's recasted my original Shin Tools and is selling them on eBay..His feedback shows he's sold 10 sets since mid-November. Has anyone run into this in the past and what did you do ??

Bobbas Clone Master: He use to go by the name Jedijeffrey but he changed it a few months ago to Vader-revealed. Notice in his ads he states no refunds on custom items

Star Wars Chick (Admin Staff): Jedijeffrey has been banned permanently. He threated legal action against us if we didn't take down the first post here. We have a ZERO tolerance for these types of threats.

Man of War Studios: He went and attacked the administration with threats of violence and legal action I was told. What did he expect was gonna happen!?

Madmartigan: Looks like he's moved on to recasting Chuck's Ruffkintoy's gauntlets. Good to see he's diversifying versus screwing over just one prop maker....

Wow, banned on The Dented Helmet (one of my favorite sites) for threatening users and for recasting. Not just one product but that of other fans! What the heck, dude? Is Darth Ugly next on your recasting list?

Let's see who you really are, Mr. "A. Schultz".

SL 847 Jeff Kindall ... stumeID=95

I made Darth Ugly for everyone because of recasters like YOU. For years you've had your bright moment in the fandom where people worshiped you and went to you for Star Wars props. You robbed from other fans and passed off their work as your own.

It must really irk you that someone who knew nothing about Vader props prior to 2006 eventually surpassed anything Vader-related you have put out. And that money is not lining your pocket any more. It's all about jealousy and control, and you playing a scorched earth card.

No, I'm onto you. I'm watching you and your garrison. The Alpine Garrison is hereby banned from any purchase of Darth Ugly because of the liklihood that you'll recast it and even remove the mount system which asks people to protect it because of its charity endeavor.

Author:  CSMacLaren [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 6:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

UPDATE: Your account "aschultz" has now been banned on RPF by Art Andrews. Your past, threats and shame have apparently caught up with you.

Art Andrews wrote:
aschultz has been verified to be JediJeffrey, a member of TDH (and SL847 of the 501st Alpine Garrison) who previously was shown to be a recaster and who subsequently made legal threats against the site. As we oversee both sites, we are extending his previous ban on TDH to his account on the RPF.

Now that this problem has been resolved, let's get this thread back on track.

SOURCE: ... ost2820426

I have nothing more to say to you. You're 42 years old and you need to find a higher purpose in life.

Author:  jedijeffrey [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Nice try, i was not banned from TDH for recasting your only showing parts of the thread. What a shock that one of your favorite sites is TDH, everyone knows that site has no integrity, just like you, you can't even answer one question.
At least everyone now knows what you really are. I don't care if people know who i am, i'm not hiding anything.
You banning a garrison, that's funny :lol
The TDH and the RPF will ban anyone who questions the admin and any of their buddies, who cares?
I just read the thread on the RPF I was banned for making legal threats :lol
I said nothing of the kind.

Author:  StarWars Collector [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

If you two have an issue with each other take it to PM or elsewhere.
If there are issues that need resolving then PM a staff member once all other options have been tried.

Now, let's get this thread back on track.

Thank you.

Author:  CSMacLaren [ Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Over the years, I've seen fellow fans go through pain whenever they've been recast. Given that so much has gone into Darth Ugly, needless to say I have my concerns as well. Some makers might put in little tells and inform a select circle of trusted fellow fans to guard that knowledge and to keep a lookout. Others might recognize a casting as not being made using the same materials.

Given the favorable reception of Darth Ugly among costumers, I am naturally cautious. Back when I first started in the hobby in 2006, the costuming community were notorious for recasting the work of fan propmakers. It didn't matter how much original work was put into a prop beyond mere duplication. They'd look at you and say, "You don't own Vader. Lucas does. And we're not making money off of it. We're trooping for charity." So they, in essence, "rape" a fan propmaker of his own sculpt and force it into the costume community's public domain. I've then watched the reaction of prop makers.

Nowadays, people are much more well informed about the ins and outs of recasting. There is greater desire to know a prop's origins and what a fan sculptor or propmaker might have done to bolster the prop.

It may very well be thanks to sites like the Den and RPF for promoting a culture of "Work in Progress" threads that show a kind of diary of the evolution of a prop. This is especially true for me, as part of a new generation of fans inheriting the previous' generations junk and refuse props, to create a story arc of garbage to gold.

Unfortunately, when you're told your helmet's recast, you can only analyze photos after the fact. By then, the damage is already done.

When bookface and I conferred on the subject, we decided to make it known from the very start that this is a humanitarian effort. And so, on the mounting system, per my request, the following words have been written into the mounting system interior. With the dome on, these words would never be seen by the public:


My hope is to basically show new owners of Ugly how important their contribution towards collecting this helmet is to us, as well as put it right in the faces of recasters that even if they have lied and stolen from fellow fans to grain profit or prestige, the removal of this "tell" we have put would really indicate what low level their self worth actually is. And recasting this even with the tell intact would be a shameful act. I've put out word in the past that if there's a recaster salivating over my work, I would work with them provided that they guarantee shipping and product fulfillment, a certain level of quality, and that the gal we're trying to help has money sent to her reliably and directly.

None of the recasters took up my challenge.


Author:  CSMacLaren [ Wed Mar 27, 2013 11:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: still ugly

Received additional threats and trolling via PM. This needs to be brought out into the open. I offered an olive branch, and this is what I got.

jedijeffrey wrote:
My quality has never been in question, i have been working with vacuumforming and molding and casting since 1997. I don't need to copy your items. But i will "rework" darth ugly in which ever way i want, cast it, and i don't need your persmission to do it. I will aslo change the areas that i want, not just what you have done to it.

jedijeffrey wrote:
You thought i was serious? ha ha :lol I have 2 ugly helmets on their way to my house. I'm going to finish them and get rid of them as my friends want nothing to do with them anymore. They are a bit different though the mounting top is different. Before I sell the 2nd one i'm going to rework it to the point that it has more alterations than you did reworking the old ugly helmet. Then it will be mine to do what i want with. The dome will be changed as well. Which I really don't need to worry because you said the dome "appeared" to be a GH so it's not yours in any way shape or form. GH did not sculpt his dome, he took it from a LFL dome that wasn't his either. and technically you did give me permission on the boards to recast Darth Ugly. You said if i wanted to all i had to do is PM which i did. :toothy

JediJeffrey took my words of collaborating with him on another sculpt and twisted into saying that I have him "permission" to recast Darth Ugly.

Well I suppose even JediJeffrey, the self-proclaimed "father" of ugly, needs to make some offspring....

But honestly, dude, you're 42. Find something better to do. You have talent to make a difference in people's lives. Try something.

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