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 Post subject: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2008 9:54 pm 
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Hi

Since I sold my ESB Vader display (only the helmet still is in my posession), I wanted to start a new vader: ROTJ.

From the time I saw the scene where Vader arrives at the death star at the beginning of Jedi, I wanted to have one. Everything starts with the helmet and so I thought I'll show some pics of my lid. I hope I'll find a decent armor for it, the tailor already has some templates for the leather suit and the gloves.

Since I'm busy with a lot of other things, this thread won't be updated quick...but regularly as I can.

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 12:05 am 
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Nice! What make of helmet is that?

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 1:20 am 
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It's a cyberman one.

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 7:14 am 
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Do you know what the basis of the helmet was? Rubie's statue, or something?

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:49 am 
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No...

It's a derivate from an elstree rotj. It's one out of ten pieces, additional details are to be found on starwarshelmets.com. In the vader fanmade section, it's named "rotj screen-used copy". Although I don't believe it is a derivate from a screenused.

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 8:14 pm 
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verry nice!! :cool:

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 6:44 pm 
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Thanks. The only thing that bothers me is the dome width, cause I think it's simply too wide on the side. Looks kinda off to me.

I hope I'll get an armor soon for him. When all hardparts are there, I think I'll get him a new paintjob but first I'll try my polish on it, since the brand I use does some freakin amazing finish.

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 10:26 pm 
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Propsmith - Yeah, but it's true to the Elstree. I may be developing a ROTJ out of one of my sculpts. I don't know just yet if it would pair up well with your Elstree mask, but you never know!

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 12:56 pm 
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Hi Mac,

As I understand, it's a modyfied elstree recast. The only thing I know about the elstree is, that it was done by an unknown prop maker in the uk from an unknown source...wow...do we know anyhting specific??

Perhaps someone can chime in and shed a bit of light onto this one regarding the sources. Since Gino stated, the elstree is an 'over sharpened, unauthentic piece of mess' (and I don't give a s***t about Gino's opinion as long as he doesn't show any proof or doesn't share information) I'm interested in the history of the elstree and this helmet from start to beginning.

btw, your work is simply stunning....

spend a lot of money on various pieces is one thing, but building something completely from scratch is most impressing. I wish I would have that talent.

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 8:16 pm 
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Propsmith,

Thanks! That's very generous of you to say.

A while back, Thomas posted this of the Elstree vs. one of the tour ROTJ.

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Structurally, the Elstree has a lot going for it.

Here is a picture of one of the two Jeff ROTJ masters:

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And here is the other one, formerly GINO's.

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As you can see from all the above, the closer you get to an LFL mold, the more detail you have. However, it's still possible to oversharpen detail when you go the bondo and sandpaper route. That being said, the amount of paint you put on there also determines how much the sharpness gets rebated. Some people see the exhibit LFL ROTJ and don't really take the amount of paint into account.

I've seen photos of an unpainted Elstree casting, and the detail is sharp. If you go very thin with the paint on an Elstree, you can get a nice sharp effect. Also, if your mask lines are done very cleanly, they will contribute to a sharp appearance. However, the sharpness of the lines can be determined by how many layers of paint you shoot it with. I'm sure in his assessment that some forget about the role of paint thickness in the final appearance of details.

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So there should be good detail (as opposed to the soft detail of a Don Post Deluxe and a lot of over-painted fanmades).

Image

It's quite possible that the master used for the limited run of 10 Elstree-derived castings was made that sharp.

Here is an LFL prop - one of the pulls from an LFL mold. That particular generation of pulls was used to engineer the ROTS Vader but this one is an unaltered pull (i.e. no symmetry).

Image

It's sharper in some respects than what we're commonly used to. It may not be quite as sharp as the Elstree, but a lovely pull nonetheless! It's not identical to the Jeff ROTJ Masters in some of its features either. So hopefully this will provide some food for thought. My favorite thing to do is to approximate the screen captures provided the screen caps were analyzed correctly. :thumbsup

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 Post subject: Re: My ROTJ Vader ... still a long way to go
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:04 pm 
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mac, this is the first time I actionally see a Jeff ROTJ...and it really looks killer.

anyway, what I think is off on my lid is the fat bottom lip. On any rotj vader (screen caps, lfl tour lid), it's simply not there only on the stunt it seems to exist but perhaps this is because of the tricky light anyway.

also, the width of the dome sides looks kinda off.

But you're absolutely right about the amount of paint which is slapped on. I saw this on my SPFX ESB.

The first thing I did when I took it out of the box was to clean the rubbish primer and beneath that, a very sharp and interesting shape came to light. When I filled little imperfections (I only filled dents and scratches, and was aware of changing details with too much bondo), I prepared the lid near to glass like finish. Very satisfying.

But when I applied the first coat of primer I was disappointed...everything was lost, but I was very carefully in not to overspray the whole thing. Since the helmet has such a complex shape, it's difficult to prime or paint it and to have an even coat.

I had to choose between to kinds of paint: paint out of ordinady spray cans or professionally spray gun.

One thing that I don't like on spray cans: The paint in there is extremely thinned. One second too much on the same spot and you have tear drops. Your have to spray many very thin coats to get an even finish. But the good thing about it is, that you don't have such a thick paintjob which kills details additionally to the thick coat of primer that's already on like you have it with automotive paint out of spray guns.

The good thing about spray guns is, that u get an even finish and a more professional looking paintjob but I think it kills the details too much if u overdoe it.

The funny thing on my lid: If you look close, you can see brush streaks! It looks lile some of the black area was done with a simple paintbrush! Perhaps I can take a decent pic of this.

Anyway, thanks for the pics, they help a lot!

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