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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 2:13 am 
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Here, it looks okay, but the dome could be better shaped.

I'd like to see if I can rework the eyes a little more. Perhaps I will.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 2:20 am 
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And here is the final shot on the day. My goodness, there's a lot of tidying that needs to be done around the eye and mouth areas.

That's it for now!


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:02 am 
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CSMacLaren wrote:
There is a site where someone tried to reposition the helmet by sawing up the mask's mounting system to angle it back and downwards. I felt it was a very creative but over-engineered solution. What I did instead was use heat to manipulate the mounting system to re-angle the receiver.


Can you give a little more info on this. I just started my Rubies Supreme mod, and was planning on doing the cut and reposition on the receiver.

What can I say for $27.50 for a supreme, and it keeps me occupied so I cant stew over other projects as bad. Also I have quite a bit of experience in working with plastic, I used to work for a model manufacture so I'll answer any plastic questions I can.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:11 am 
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Well, in order to cover the back of the neck, the dome needs to merely be angled downwards. But the mask needs to also be recessed. So what I did was heat the receiver, and then I push it backwards and inwards into the helmet. Then, holding it place, I cooled it with water.

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In this photo, the left and right are the before and after pictures. Note that the receiver is not only angled backwards but it's been pushed inwards. This will alter the shape of the skull, but what the hey, it's going to be under the helmet. It's not like it was perfect anyway!

Some people try to add an extra inch or two to the flange of their helmets, basically transforming Vader's flange into Mary Poppin's skits.

Now, on some helmets, you really do have to lengthen the flange, such as the Don Post Classic Action.

On others, if you lengthen it, you run the risk of altering the proportions. In trying to cover the back of the neck in the name of being screen accurate, a flange that is too long is disproportionate to the domecap and thus looks inaccurate.

The problem with cutting the plastic of the dome is that you have to somehow weld the plastic. There are a variety of expoxy products that can stick to and look seamless with the plastic, but if they are more stiff than the plastic itself, if the plastic is flexed, it will strain against the stiff expoxy products and crack at the weld. That sucks.

The BEST thing to do is to not cut up the plastic in the first place but to alter the general shape.

I like the dome positioning as it is right now. I'm glad it worked out.


Last edited by CSMacLaren on Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:35 am, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:15 am 
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Dark Lord wrote:
What can I say for $27.50 for a supreme, and it keeps me occupied so I cant stew over other projects as bad. Also I have quite a bit of experience in working with plastic, I used to work for a model manufacture so I'll answer any plastic questions I can.


The thing that gets me is that I've spent over $200 in sandpaper, tools, materials, etc. and many months to the point that the helmet is not a cost effective or time-efficient modification.

I do credit the process for teaching me what I needed to know to begin my work on my even worse Golden Armor kit. That knowledge was very important which in turn helped me with my scratchbuilt ROTS Vader which gave me the experience to turn the Golden Armor into an Elstree wannabe.

Now I'm working on the Rubie's again.

The thing that also gets me is that I see people do 4 or maybe even 6 modifications and shoot it with black gloss paint, and it looks GREAT. Here, I'm schlepping on the extreme of 18 modifications, and only recently it's begun to look a little like a Don Post. If I had stopped back at 4-6 modifications I think I would have been a happier man and would have gotten to enjoy my mask sooner. Now I've been ruined; I see the deficiencies of the Rubie's and my eye has been developed to spot inconsistencies to the screen-used prop all too quickly! :angry4

At this rate, the best it will look is a little like a Don Post. But I still may have a trick up my sleeve....


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:47 am 
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Thanks for the info Mac. I agree that if you do the 4 or 5 mods required for 501st approval your helmet still looks like a moded Rubies. Take your mods to the next level and people start taking notice at a nice looking helmet.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:22 am 
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I wasn't aware the 501st had a requirement of 4-5 mods. My statement wasn't intended to knock the 501st nor its requirements. I hope I didn't offend.

Sometimes it's a bit of pressure to have to make something so accurate before people really like it, and I count at least 18 inaccuracies which I've attempted to address. Despite these efforts, I envy people who can make the masses happy with a mere 4-5 changes and lots of gloss black paint. I admit, they look great! Then I go back to my bench and kick myself for working so darn hard....

It's the Rubie's plastic.... it's really getting to me. Rassen-frassin it! It hates me... it taunts me... it mocks me!! :toothy

In truth, I much prefer other materials such as epoxies, clays, polyurethanes and resins with which I have been able to do so much more (see my other threads in this Works in Progress forum). The degrees of artistry and accuracy that I'd like to see with any of my helmet projects is limited in the Rubie's by virtue of the very limiting and unforgiving material it is made of.

But, not to worry. I've already begun some new mods to the mask. It's about to get better....

:toothy


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:41 pm 
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CSMacLaren wrote:
I wasn't aware the 501st had a requirement of 4-5 mods. My statement wasn't intended to knock the 501st nor its requirements. I hope I didn't offend.


No offense taken. It's well known that a stock Rubies is not accurate enough to be accepted into the 501st.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:34 pm 
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Ironically, it's the Rubie's that brought me into this community. I saw Chad Vader on YouTube and saw the production's website plug for a costume retailer who sold the Rubie's Supreme Vader full costume. Well, before dropping $700-900 I wanted to find out how good it really was.

My first exposure to the community brought me into the Jedi Council Forums where there was intense disagreement on whether or not the Rubie's was 501st-acceptable. Many believed it should because it was a licensed product. Some who had spent upwards of $2,000 probably looked down on the Rubie's because a similar costume could be acquired in one purchase but for so much less.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:48 pm 
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So... some eye surgery....

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The key was for me to add the menace back in. I'll refine it later.

I added some makeshift highlights because the weather is quite overcast today.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:55 pm 
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It looks much nicer, but I'm spoiled. I really like my "Goldie" much more. With resin, my materials such as Aquamend, etc. are very comparable with my resin (or resin + fiberglass) projects. If I don't like something, I can eradicate it and start over. Or I can build on top of it and fundamentally change the shape.

With this plastic, it's a different story. I've not found anything that is truly compatable with this plastic. As good as Aquamend has been over other stuff, it is still -- at the end of the day -- a FG repair product. It's great for fixing holes in the hulls of boats. FG is usually used with a resin, so when you sand Aquamend, it's like sanding resin (and, of course, that depends on your formulation of resin and how hard it is.)


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:57 pm 
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I have this sore temptation to file the teeth to make it look more like the Don Post Deluxe, but I'll leave the teeth straight so it's more like the Don Post Classic Action. The work on the eyes have already made it look different than the DPCA.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 5:02 pm 
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The one thing I never really liked about the Rubie's is that it looks forced. Rubie's claims it's "cast from originals" but when I look at it, there have been so many modifications that anything intrinsic to the original is so buried deep down that it almost looks like an original sculpt. There are one or two things such as the side cheek lines and the right neck flare that cause me to wonder, "If this was an original sculpt, why did they bother to replicate these two oddities that most fans are totally unaware of?" So it is possible it was cast from an original and then modified, remolded and recast to form the Surpeme line.

From this particular angle, the Rubie's is starting to not look so forced.

Image

It's beginning to have an organic quality to it. Hopefully the gloss black will make it look better. The key thing about gloss black paint, IMHO, is that you're seeing more what it reflects, and you're seeing less of the actual mask.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 5:04 pm 
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THEN... and NOW

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The left shot was when I completed my very first round of modifications that were in part following someone else's tutorial and in part me wanting to do something other tutorials hadn't covered at the time. Most did not build out the right mouth wall. Later ones did, but they didn't cover the teeth or the bottom mouth wall.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 5:08 pm 
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And here is a comp with a photo of the Rubie's at the very beginning of this thread.

Image

This is when I was building out the right mouth wall with QuikSteel or PC Plumbing (forgot which) which turned out to be the wrong stuff to use.

Looking back, the eyes were atrocious.

Anyways, I'm not 100% certain my Rubie's is near final yet. There's still a thing or two I may want to do to make it more authentic looking.


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