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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 4:25 pm 
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This will help people understand that there are three angles of rotation.

http://www.nasm.si.edu/exhibitions/gal1 ... TF541B.HTM

They are: pitch, roll and yaw.

This may also help:

NASA.gov's website.
http://virtualskies.arc.nasa.gov/aerona ... &Pitch.gif

Vertical tilt is also known as pitch, and this is where we get the term that someone's "pitched forward."

If you're increasing the brow gap, regardless of how you do it (e.g. velcro, dome mounting) you are still altering the three dimensional dome positioning in relation to the mask.

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Last edited by CSMacLaren on Thu Jan 10, 2008 9:52 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 5:17 pm 
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NoHumorMan wrote:
And just to clarify. This was part of Mac's original run-down:

CSMacLaren wrote:
Once you've achieved proper vertical tilt, the rest is basically how deep the mask recesses into the dome as well as how much the rim needs to conceal or expose the eyes.

The eyebrows/front rim of the dome was worn progressively higher as you move from ANH to ESB to ROTJ.


And since we are all now talking about the same thing, something which was mentioned in the first posts, then I can't help but think that most of what happened in these threads was pointless arguing for whatever reasons.


Simple. Gino speaks chinese so he was repeating what had already been said in the first initial posts by Mac. In turn, Mac was speaking in Latin so Gino didn't understand him. It's funny how things all work themselves out.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 5:36 pm 
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I had earlier withdrawn my previous post, but I feel that a crash course in terminology will perhaps help. Please look at the second post immediately prior to this one.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 10:06 pm 
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So now that it seems we are on the same page...

The verdict is, that the ROTJ helms are indeed face tweaked ESB helmets (same mounting) just a shifted backward tilt of the dome -- correct?

Doug


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 10:08 pm 
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wannab wrote:
So now that it seems we are on the same page...
The verdict is, that the ROTJ helms are indeed face tweaked ESB helmets (same mounting) just a shifted backward tilt of the dome -- correct?
Doug

No, that is not correct. That is a plausible, but unsupported theory presented by GINO.

What this thread was about is difference in ESB vs RotJ dome position, which it seems we are now in agreement on.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 10:09 pm 
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wannab wrote:
So now that it seems we are on the same page...

The verdict is, that the ROTJ helms are indeed face tweaked ESB helmets (same mounting) just a shifted backward tilt of the dome -- correct?

Doug


The domes are different and ROTJs sit higher on the face. That's basically it. One was proven in another thread and yet another in this thread. Changing the rear tilt has nothing to do with how high the frontal section sits on the faceplate.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 10:38 pm 
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Karo,

Could you clarify that last comment? By tilting the rear up, don't you end up pivoting the front rim downwards?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 10:46 pm 
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CSMacLaren wrote:
Karo,

Could you clarify that last comment? By tilting the rear up, don't you end up pivoting the front rim downwards?


No, not necessarily. If you have the front of the dome velcroed to the face, you have play in the rear tilting of the dome. The top front portion of the dome would protude out further, but the brow curve would in essence stay in the same position. It's easier to show in pics than to explain in words, but I'm not able to do that at the moment. That's why, for example, on a DP DLX you can adjust the inner ring/attachment (cut it down) of the faceplate and change how the dome tilt changes in the rear, but keep the same level on the front of the faceplate/dome brow height. Hope that makes sense to you.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 12:05 am 
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DK,
Having experimented with the domes & masks I have, I have to disagree that "Changing the rear tilt has nothing to do with how high the frontal section sits on the faceplate". I have been able to achive various looks by tilting the dome forward or back on the same mounting. The mount itself is a starting point but how you attach to the velcro gives different looks. Attach low and on the inside the rear of the dome mount lifts off the rear of the face mount and vice-versa.

As to the dome difference, I understood that the ESB dome was worked on giving the ROTJ a different look (not a new dome, just smoothed and sanded)?

Just trying to wade through the muck and get things straight in my head. :wink:

Doug


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 12:54 am 
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Actually what the two of you are discussing are congruous. It depends on the pivot point.

If you picture the skull as a pivot point, then raising the rear will bring the brow forward.

If you picture the brow as the pivot point, then raising the rear will not bring the brow forward.

So both of you are right depending on what you're defining as a center of axis of rotation.

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