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 Post subject: A Second Original ANH Vader Helmet?
PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:10 pm 
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Well, since you guys are so nice to me today :lol I thought I'd share the love so it's time to discuss my avatar.

Image

Now keep in mind I have thought about camera angle, distance etc. but because I have the SL ANH I can rotate it around and see if I can get the same effects...but it still seems different to me.

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This is a photograph of Bob Anderson wearing an original ANH Vader costume. Although Bob isn't formally listed in the credits for ANH, he consulted with Peter Diamond on the use of the lightsabers for ANH. He's listed in Imdb as a stunt double. I've never seen this photograph published anywhere, so it's a prize in my collection. When I get home maybe I'll write up what was said about this photo. For the longest time I just appreciated the angle and drama of the photo, but then after the HD versions of Star Wars became available, I compared this photo to the one of Vader looking down at Ben Kenobi's cloak. And there were a few things that made me wonder....why does this helmet look so different?

Well, I'll maybe show a comparison later, but there are a number of things that I found different about this helmet, even something I found out last night.

First thing that caught my eye was the paint boundary on the nose. Where the black paint goes over the nose and there's a paint boundary between the black and gunmetal...on Vader's right side under the eye. That paint line or boundary on the screen ANH is quite straight when looking down on the mask, but on this one it's more curved. The right tusk tubes on this one seem thinner toward the end than on the screen mask. The dome or helmet itself seems different both in terms of the width of the flaring edge and the eyebrow line shape (although that could just be the angle). I checked last night the grill mesh on this one, something I was meaning to do...and compared it to the screen mesh and the center and left gaps show a different pattern (!!!). The right tubes as well appear blacker but that could be lighting. There's also a distinctive paint blemish pattern on the right front cheek of this one that's different than the screen mask. Also, there's a black mark going down the right side of the mouth triangle...that particular feature looked familiar to me and I think (I'll have to look for it) it's on a photo of Vader in the Death Star council chamber. The nosebridge also appears to be darker than that of the screen mask. The photo itself seems to have been taken in uniform overhead light so I doubt it's the lighting that makes it look darker, as with the tubes. Oh, and the tusks seem different in shading. Anyway, I'll try to show more about what I mean later when I get to my home computer.

In essence, my guess is that Bob is wearing a second ANH Vader helmet that was used as a stunt helmet. But, I have yet to find it onscreen.

One thing I'll add is that this could have been around the time of ESB but it's an ANH suit. And there seems to be a widow's peak.


Last edited by SithLord on Thu May 01, 2008 4:35 am, edited 5 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:31 pm 
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Interesting write-up and looking forward to hearing more. There's not much to really go by with that small picture, so I'll just let you do the talking, with me doing the listening! :lol

Keep it cool! :cheers

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:58 pm 
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There's only one thing that I have to disagree on with regard to the black paint line of vader's right side. On the screen used it also curves out similar to that photo. The flaring edge does appear a bit thin. I agree with your other observations and look forward to whatever else you have to show and tell.


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 3:01 am 
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Ok I've added a comparison....I realize it curves out...but along it's length it's straight if you get my meaning...this other helmet seems to have real curvature on that paint line...

Incidentally in the photo (I'm not showing all of it), the armor is all black...not two-toned.

At the time Bob Anderson was director of the Canadian Fencing Association.


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 3:29 am 
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Yeah I see what you mean about the line. Hmm tough to say, that dome is throwing me off. Something about it just doesn't seem right. I'll take a gander through ANH again. Maybe we could find that helmet elsewhere. Here's a similar shot of the original, but this one was taken in 1978.

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 4:21 am 
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This is just my opinion but the one on the right looks more ESB to me. Notice the widows peak looks softer and the dome "flares" over the eyes look higher arching. That may be the difference.


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 4:38 am 
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Yes I thought that too...that the eyebrows seem more ESB...but there's definitely a widow's peak...

DK....that helmet you show...look at the chin vent...it looks ESB...??? The paintwork doesn't look like the screen ANH...it could be a tour helmet.

I need to check the grill pattern if it's the same as the original ANH...


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 4:47 am 
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SithLord wrote:
Yes I thought that too...that the eyebrows seem more ESB...but there's definitely a widow's peak...

DK....that helmet you show...look at the chin vent...it looks ESB...??? The paintwork doesn't look like the screen ANH...it could be a tour helmet.

I need to check the grill pattern if it's the same as the original ANH...


That was KE as vader for the 50th Academy Awards held on 04/03/1978. I believe it's the original screen used, but cleaned up and possibly even repainted.

Since I'm in a sharing kinda mood (John Mollo, Natalie Wood & Vader)

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 8:17 am 
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The armor in that last picture looks all black too. Really difficult to determine with the ANH paint job.


One thing I noticed, and sorry if you mentioned it Thomas, but doesn't the left tusk tubes look grey and the right ones look black on your picture or do you think that's caused by lighting and shadow?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 2:29 pm 
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Well Vader's left tube looks black to me...so the opposite of the screen mask.

Ok I examined this photo...great photo BTW thanks for sharing...haven't seen it that large. The grill on the Academy Award (AA) Vader is different than the one in my photo. I thought they were the same suit because yes the armor is all black too, but on mine the armor is more bumpy and I can actually see the smaller chin vent.

It's amazing...the AA Vader has an ESB sized chin vent...maybe that's when they decided to increase the size? Before ESB? For the tour suits?

Look at the gloves of the AA Vader, the gloves on mine are the same. Not the original ANH gloves. So either tour gloves or there were gloves like that used in ANH...we should check the fight scenes with Obi-Wan on the death star to see what gloves Vader had.

The beltbox set is also different on the suit Bob A is wearing. Sorry I'm not showing the whole photo. The red/green buttons on the chestbox are different too. And on the AA Vader, the right tusk is very glossy black but on the BA Vader it's silver....both are silver. The paintwork on the BA mask and dome are more matt like ANH and less glossy like this AA helmet which almost certainly is a tour helmet because we know the original screen mask retained it's small chin vent during the tour and in that photo taken of it at Elstree.

thanks!


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 2:40 pm 
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The Hoth helmet seems to have that chin vent size. A bit larger than ANH, but not as large as ESB. Though, the pictures I have are pretty crappy...

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 2:57 pm 
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Thomas, the picture of the ANH on the shelf has two silver tusks and a thinner flange rim. Could this be the same helmet?

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 5:28 pm 
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I thought that one was all black?


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 6:24 pm 
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It appears to have a two-tone paint scheme, but the picture I have is a very small one... it's on this page in post #9 in the gallery section: http://thepropden.aokforums.com/2-vt77. ... c&start=15

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 7:29 pm 
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Just enlarged it from that photo...I don't see any gunmetal....I might have a sharper version...see the straps...nice...I wonder if this is the same single ANH helmet that Mike said he saw recently in the archives and said this was the only ANH helmet there....interesting. By the way, photo credit for this I think goes to Darth Jones.

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