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 Post subject: Vaderman Stormtrooper Armour & Liz Moore Helmet Discussi
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:18 pm 
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New thread at the request of the mods for discussion of the original helmet and armour sculpting...

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Well here we go guys hold onto your hats!!!

This is the long awaited photo of the clay sculpt I saw outside the sculpting studio in the Art Dept at Elstree. It arrived at the studio around mid February. As I've always stated it was not sculpted at Elstree.

The photo was taken in the Art Dept at Elstree.

Brian

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Just to clarify who sculpted the original clay helmet for the Stormtrooper as in photo. Liz Moore sculpted the helmet - she did not do it at Elstree studios. At the time although I saw the helmet outside the sculpting studio I was curious who had done it but not curious enough to find out.

In later years when asked if Liz had sculpted it I answered no because it wasn't done at the studios. As Ainsworth then claimed to have sculpted it I had no reason to doubt him. As a result of the pending court case I started to ask people who were there at the time.

When Liz Moore left Star Wars at the end of January/early February to be with her boyfriend John Richardson (who was working on a film in Holland) he set up a studio for her. She sculpted the Stormtrooper helmet there and brought it back to Elstree. It was only speaking to John who is also working on Harry Potter that this was brought to light.

John made a statement and testified in court as Liz could not speak for herself and felt it was important that she was credited for the work she had done.


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I think you're getting carried away with tiny detail. If you look at the bottom of the sculpt there are small shavings of clay which shows it was still being worked on.

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Last edited by JoeR on Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:25 pm 
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Continued from this thread that went a little south: http://thepropden.aokforums.com/vaderma ... t1769.html

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:25 pm 
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Some may be wondering about the blue helmet on the right of the clay helmet.

This was not done at Elstree it was brought in.

Nick Pemberton stated that he'd sculpted a helmet and although he wanted it believed it was the clay helmet that has now been disproved.
I can only assume that he cobbled the blue helmet together. It was not sculpted per say it is formed with a series of components married together with plasticine and sprayed blue to make it look one piece. Clay work in the studios would not be sprayed as it makes any changes difficult.


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Keep watching there's plenty more to come.

The Ainsworth Fairytale..............................

I'm posting some screen captures of the dvd Ainsworth produced in court to 'prove' that he sculpted the helmet and said he sculpted the armour using the same technique. Considering he had over a year to do this come to your own conclusions. The film was edited at each stage so we don't know how long it took.

He stated that Pemberton gave him the clay helmet and he ruined it in the rush to produce a plastic prototype. He then 'sculpted' a helmet with the method shown. Within 48 hours and no reference he produced it from his head and miraculously it turned out the same as the clay.


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It was sculpted as a complete helmet - it's split into pieces in the casting stage and then made into tools (positive moulds) for the vac form to be pulled over.


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Just as a finishing note tonight

Ainsworth stated that he saw the clay sculpt but that it was of no use because you can't mould from clay.

Anyone with any knowledge of mould making knows that you can:

1. Do a plaster waste mould
2. Do a fibre glass mould ( as long as the undercuts aren't too severe as to become a trap)
3. There are many silicone rubbers on the market which you can either make a case and pour the rubber into the void between the sculpt and case. Or you can paint the rubber on with a thickening agent so it holds onto the sculpt and then put the case over that. This is the cheaper and not so accurate way of doing it.
4. Vinymould rubbers are heated in a copper (heating pot) and can be poured on panels and a case put on afterwards when it's cooled and hardened- or the first method in number 3.

Brian

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:28 pm 
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Quote:
To continue...................

Ainsworth laid claim to 'designing' several of the helmets. In his statement he stated that he made the helmets and John Mollo then drew them afterwards.

As those of you know who have met John he is extremely talented and a real gentleman. He had to endure 2 days in the witness box being questioned on his honesty.

Realising his grave error in putting John's honesty into question Ainsworth changed his statement the following day. We watched Ainsworth being cross examined about this and the example of the Outlander helmet was brought into it. Ainsworth stated that he had no drawings from John but that they were both artists and John was a good communicator. The barrister asked how he had communicated and Ainsworth intimated that it was by telepathy

After a lot of squirming and intervention from the judge he finally conceded that he must have had a drawing.

As you are now becoming aware Ainsworth has sullied more than my reputation.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:48 pm 
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This thread reads a lot easier now youve just got the facts.


cheers for redoing this piece of history for the rest of us.

Much appreciated



cheers

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:07 pm 
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Cole's Notes version! Perfect...thanks Joe!


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:54 pm 
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Is it just the foreshortening in the photo, or was the helmet sculpted "larger than life?"
I realize it's in the foreground but it looks friggin HUUUUUGE!

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:57 pm 
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I think that's the perspective of the photo giving that impression... there really isn't much in the foreground near the helmets to really give off any scale comparison. Lucas stands far back in the picture.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 4:02 pm 
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Yeah that makes much better reading, thanks. :)

So, AA is trying to say he had some input into the final tool moulds for vac forming then.

Brian, we met at Memorbilia a while back and we discussed this same kind of thing. I think AA was also there that year? Not sure. I'll forgive you for not remembering me as I'm sure you spoke to loads of folk that day :) I'm Welsh, if that jogs anything, lol

Brian, can you confirm the clay scuplts were made into vac forming tools by someone else other than AA please?

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:10 pm 
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Ready to hear what you have to say. :)


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:29 pm 
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Am I missing something here? AA says he couldn't use the original clay sculpture because he supposedly couldn't make a mold off of clay. So what does he do... he resculpts it... out of clay?

The PDF that is/was on his website contains verbage on how he imagined and conceived of the Stormtrooper and why the design ended up being such.

Clearly this is misinformation.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:41 am 
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Fascinating stuff and thanks for sharing it Brian but Carsten or whoevers in charge now isn't this thread about Liz Moores helmet titles a bit missleading, lets have some recognition for the lady huh ?
I know i don't post around here much anymore either so probably sounds a bit brash but can't you keep the AA crud in the other thread because this one will only end up going to the dogs too like every other thread he's mentioned in.

Anyway back on topic thanks again Brian and i look forward to learning more about your armour sculpt.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:57 am 
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I don't see it as misleading in that I don't think the person starting the thread intended to say the Stormtrooper was sculpted by someone other than Liz Moore. This was initially more a Q&A with Brian regarding his past experience. He did sculpt the armor. Perhaps an Intro paragraph in Post #1 could be amended to make special mention of her.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:58 am 
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I understand Mac there was no mention of intent though, didn't even cross my mind ,but the title is misleading if someone see's a thread and expects to see a helmet sculpted by Vaderman.
If you'd like to discuss it PM please lets keep this one on track :salut.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:17 am 
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Defstartrooper wrote:
I understand Mac there was no mention of intent though, didn't even cross my mind ,but the title is misleading if someone see's a thread and expects to see a helmet sculpted by Vaderman.
If you'd like to discuss it PM please lets keep this one on track :salut.


You have a valid point, sir! Not everyone arriving at this thread would have read up on the previous thread to understand the context.

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